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dimenno
Seriously--it's amazing, I know.
swid
Custer's Revenge, 1982.
screeg neegis
Fuck Custer.
Believe it or not, Custer fancied himself a "friend" of the American Indians.

Yet, on the day he died he and his men were on a search and destroy mission to kill Indians - men, women and children, without mercy - and got his men killed because he wanted another such "victory" to polish up his impending run for the presidency.

I recommend a book about the Battle of Little Big Horn:
"Killing Custer: The Battle of Little Big Horn and the Fate of the Plains Indians" by James Welch - which describes the battle from the Indian's point of view and the resulting campaign of genocide that followed it.


A review on Amazon by Andrew Freborg :
"During WWII, they were called "Einsatzgruppen." Long a student of both WWII and 19th Century US history, the parallels in some respect stand-out clearly - and Custer buffs don't like it.

The authors present a compelling synposis of the "cleansing" of the native tribes from the northern plains. Especially interesting is the presentation of the subjugation of the Blackfeet nation in the years prior to the Army's (Sherman and Sheridan's War Dept.) on the Lakota, Cheyenne and Arapaho.

Custer was an instrument - a product of his time, but a willing instrument nonetheless. The shameful actions of this period can only be healed with honest accounting - and thats what the authors accomplish with this work.

The narative is highly readable, engaging, and written with a clarity and perspective of the Native peoples. Yes, it contains commentary - sometimes scathing. On the other had, I defy anyone to find a historical work on NAZI Germany in which such editorializing is absent. "

"Einsatzgruppen" might be a stretch - Custer lead regular US Army troops, not paramilitary thugs, but their intent was the same.

The Einsatzgruppen
The Einsatzgruppen were four paramilitary units established before the invasion of the Soviet Union for the purpose of "liquidating" (murdering) Jews, Romany, and political operatives of the Communist party. Ultimately three of these groups (Einsatzgruppen A, B. and C) were attached to army groups taking part in the invasion.
http://www.holocaust-history.org/intro-einsatz/

In 1875, Custer swore by White Buffalo Calf Pipe, a pipe sacred to the Lakota, that he would not fight Native Americans again. A medicine man then told Custer that if he ever broke his promise he would die on that day. Forgetting his promise, Custer attacked the encampment of Cheyenne, Arapaho and Sioux at the Little Big Horn on June 25, 1876 and he died on that day. To the Native Americans, "the inevitable outcome -- Custer's personal annihilation ... -- was proof of the working of great spiritual power."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/George_Armstrong_Custer





ShempTheOtherStooge
QUOTE(screeg neegis @ Sep 23 2007, 11:14 PM) *

Fuck Custer.
Believe it or not, Custer fancied himself a "friend" of the American Indians.

Yet, on the day he died he and his men were on a search and destroy mission to kill Indians - men, women and children, without mercy - and got his men killed because he wanted another such "victory" to polish up his impending run for the presidency.

I recommend a book about the Battle of Little Big Horn:
"Killing Custer: The Battle of Little Big Horn and the Fate of the Plains Indians" by James Welch - which describes the battle from the Indian's point of view and the resulting campaign of genocide that followed it.
A review on Amazon by Andrew Freborg :
"During WWII, they were called "Einsatzgruppen." Long a student of both WWII and 19th Century US history, the parallels in some respect stand-out clearly - and Custer buffs don't like it.

The authors present a compelling synposis of the "cleansing" of the native tribes from the northern plains. Especially interesting is the presentation of the subjugation of the Blackfeet nation in the years prior to the Army's (Sherman and Sheridan's War Dept.) on the Lakota, Cheyenne and Arapaho.

Custer was an instrument - a product of his time, but a willing instrument nonetheless. The shameful actions of this period can only be healed with honest accounting - and thats what the authors accomplish with this work.

The narative is highly readable, engaging, and written with a clarity and perspective of the Native peoples. Yes, it contains commentary - sometimes scathing. On the other had, I defy anyone to find a historical work on NAZI Germany in which such editorializing is absent. "

"Einsatzgruppen" might be a stretch - Custer lead regular US Army troops, not paramilitary thugs, but their intent was the same.

The Einsatzgruppen
The Einsatzgruppen were four paramilitary units established before the invasion of the Soviet Union for the purpose of "liquidating" (murdering) Jews, Romany, and political operatives of the Communist party. Ultimately three of these groups (Einsatzgruppen A, B. and C) were attached to army groups taking part in the invasion.
http://www.holocaust-history.org/intro-einsatz/

In 1875, Custer swore by White Buffalo Calf Pipe, a pipe sacred to the Lakota, that he would not fight Native Americans again. A medicine man then told Custer that if he ever broke his promise he would die on that day. Forgetting his promise, Custer attacked the encampment of Cheyenne, Arapaho and Sioux at the Little Big Horn on June 25, 1876 and he died on that day. To the Native Americans, "the inevitable outcome -- Custer's personal annihilation ... -- was proof of the working of great spiritual power."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/George_Armstrong_Custer


The indians were as guilty of atrocities as were white settlers. The only way to avoid the Indian Wars and the subjugation of the Indian nation would have been to deny settlement of North America and that was an inevitability. I shake my head whenever I read another rant from a self loathing american who's read another revisionist history book.

I have to admit that this is the first time I've heard the post civil war US military compared to Nazi Einsatzgruppen.
Quill
Seems to be an opportunity to invoke Ugol's Law in Native American genocide.

The human population of every continent acquired their lands by displacing another people and we've been doing it since homo sapien killed off the Neanderthals. Mankind is the the current version of an increasingly aggressive and dangerous species.

If a weird Bermuda triangle event sent the students of a large modern high school back to year 1 AD Spain, their children would dominate the Roman Empire within a century.
RockZilla
QUOTE(Quill @ Sep 24 2007, 09:00 AM) *


The human population of every continent acquired their lands by displacing another people




What human population did the Native American's kill off & displace as they crossed the land bridge and settled the continent?
Quill
QUOTE(RockZilla @ Sep 24 2007, 09:29 AM) *

What human population did the Native American's kill off & displace as they crossed the land bridge and settled the continent?


Yes, those were the innocent first peoples without sin who never knew war or atrocity; the children of Adam and Eve. Got me there, Rev.
JodyThePig
QUOTE(ShempTheOtherStooge @ Sep 24 2007, 07:36 AM) *

I shake my head whenever I read another rant from a self loathing american who's read another revisionist history book.

Please allow me to indulge in one of my pet peeves: All history since the Greeks has been revisionist.

Recommended reading on this question:

IPB Image

I'm not among those who call the decimation of Native Americans genocide, as the long-term goal of the federal state was not to wipe them off the face of the earth, but to convert them into American individualist (i.e., not tribalist) farmers. I don't think that destruction of a culture/cultures constitutes genocide, however many people died in the process.

The reference to Einsatzgruppen and "cleansing" in the piece cited above is an attempt at definition by ahistorical association, and therefore poo from a historical standpoint.

Trust me. I know all. I see all.
tom from out of town
History is written by the victors but edited by the otherwise unemployable
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